A Lapse In Judgment (OOC)

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Talanall
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And of course, if Thunk actually does kill the dude, all those skeletons will no longer be under his control. And who knows what'd happen then, really? The rules aren't super clear about that. Maybe they just walk down the riverbed until they get to wherever Werner told them to go, and then stop. Maybe they try to kill the nearest living creatures. Maybe something else entirely.

The fact that Werner readily invited Thunk to smash one of them probably is indicative that these things regenerate or have fast healing, anyway. So destroying them probably isn't going to be fun or easy (or possible) if they become hostile as a result of their master's death.

Thunk may not see a problem with any of that—or more likely, Thunk may not have thought about any of that—but it's really the primary reason why Dalvar is politely suggesting that Werner should leave, rather than switching to Orcish to suggest that Thunk should kill this unsettling new talky man.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

Fixxxer
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Darker wrote:

Thunk's not anti-murdery. Not really pro-murdery either. Sometimes murder happens, what are you going to do?

Put ranks into Craft (culinary)?

Board Rider
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Would it be too early to introduce another paladin into the group who is looking for Gideon since they're brothers and its been awhile since they spoke?

MinusInnocence
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Board Rider wrote:

Would it be too early to introduce another paladin into the group who is looking for Gideon since they're brothers and its been awhile since they spoke?

Careful that you don't get typecast!

But no, in all seriousness: a paladin is probably right up there with necromancers in terms of classes you shouldn't pick. In fact I will have to veto that proposal right out of the gate. But the prospect of Gideon having relatives isn't a bad idea.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

deadDMwalking
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If I can read between the lines here, Gideon 'fell' because he hung out with Dalvar (knowingly associating with someone evil). And it could happen again...

Talanall
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Was Gideon a paladin??

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

Board Rider
Board Rider's picture

Haha..no. He started out as a Duskblade then...oh, well, I can't tell.

I was referring to your campaign and how I intoduced a paladin there.

Board Rider
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Message sent to MinusInnocence.

deadDMwalking
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Oh, well, never mind then. I'll just take it as a lesson to avoid teaming up with anyone that has a class name that includes 'dusk', 'umbral', 'shadow', 'dark', or 'twilight'.

Fixxxer
Fixxxer's picture

Darkshadow Umbral Twilight of the Dark the Third, esq.

Talanall
Talanall's picture

Jim Darkmagic III, of the Newhamp Shire Darkmagics.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

Board Rider
Board Rider's picture

I was going to respond in a similar fashion but he wrote class names not character names. Unless he meant character name then...okay.

deadDMwalking
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BR gets me.

Umbral Deathtalker. Dark Warrior. Twilight Sparkle???

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

OK so I was a little drunk a few days ago, but I didn't think I was THAT drunk. I could have sworn I updated the IC thread. I will get back to that again momentarily.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

Well, we got to talk about the possibility that Gideon has relatives for the Heroes of Haranshire to track down and murder. So that's okay.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Knowledge (dungeoneering), please.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

Knowledge (dungeoneering)

I rolled 1d20+10, the result is 20, 10 = 30.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

Fixxxer
Fixxxer's picture

Roll

Knowledge (dungeoneering)
I rolled 1d20+6, the result is 13, 6 = 19.
deadDMwalking
deadDMwalking's picture

I do that.

K: Dungeon Construction techniques and such
I rolled 1d20+6, the result is 3, 6 = 9.
deadDMwalking
deadDMwalking's picture

I think we could take them out at range. I have a bow. Looks like I don't have my most up-to-date character sheet, though, so I should fix that.

Darker

Dungeon Knowing

I rolled 1d20+3, the result is 20, 3 = 23.
Darker

Woo! Thunk gets natural 20 knowing as well.

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Argus has never seen a wasp that big, so he assumes Garyld must be mistaken or maybe he just got too much sun today.

Feruq knows everything about creatures with the Vermin type, including that they are mindless and have darkvision to a range of 60'. He also knows that, predictably, giant wasps have a particularly painful sting; their venom makes the victim's limbs sluggish and unresponsive.

Thunk knows all of that as well as confirming that while wasps can crawl around on the ground about as quickly as Jugg can walk, they are extremely quick and agile in the air. Dalvar knows this, too, and in addition to being able to clear the distance over the river between them and the Heroes in only a few seconds, he's pretty sure the wasps are already aware of their presence (or will be soon enough if they linger here en masse). Their racial modifier to the Perception skill is significant.

Re: attacking them - Argus can fire his composite longbow without even needing to dismount and will only suffer a -2 penalty on attack rolls at this distance. The same goes for Dalvar, but the penalty for Thunk if he uses his light crossbow will be -4 (it's another range increment for him).

This brings up a secondary issue that I don't think has come up before in any games I've been a part of, and that's whether or not someone can reload a crossbow while in the saddle. I think the version of the light crossbow we see on the weapons chart in the Core Rulebook is meant to represent the kind with a stirrup on the front that you would typically put on the ground and put your foot through, pulling back on the string by hand until it locks into place. If anyone is strong enough to do something like that without actually getting off his horse, it's probably Thunk, but it still sounds like a very awkward sequence of movements to perform without having some kind of mishap.

Similarly, Dalvar's crossbow is more like the kind you would need to use something like a cranequin or windlass to winch the string back into place, because the weapon's draw strength is just too severe for a regular person to handle it. Then again, this is D&D and it's possible for someone who is still basically the same size and shape of a regular human to have Strength scores from 19-30 or beyond; so I guess you could design one of those with a stirrup and someone like Thunk could try to do it by hand. But that's not the scenario we're working on right now. Dalvar's Strength is... quite a bit lower than Thunk's.

It looks to me from watching videos of people working with reproductions of historical weapons that someone could probably juggle all of the different equipment and steps to the process for reloading a crossbow while mounted. Maybe not a windlass, since with a lot of those you were still expected to hold it straight by putting your foot in the stirrup; but I saw a guy using a cranequin on a reproduction of a Renaissance-era model and it took a lot less room.

Anyway, I think for the sake of simplicity we're going to rule that while you can fire a crossbow (heavy or light) while mounted (or even from a prone position), you really do have to be standing or sitting on the floor or in a chair or something to reload one.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Do Argus and Feruq have anything to say about Dalvar's proposal?

Random
I rolled 1d20, the result is 5 = 5.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 2 = 2.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 17 = 17.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 1 = 1.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 1 = 1.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Not to be THAT guy but this is one of those situations where 20 mindless warriors who have Damage Reduction against piercing weapons and can't be poisoned would come in really handy.

Random
I rolled 1d20, the result is 14 = 14.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 5 = 5.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 16 = 16.
I rolled 1d10, the result is 4 = 4.
I rolled 1d10, the result is 5 = 5.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Roll initiative!

Initiative
I rolled 1d20, the result is 19 = 19.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 12 = 12.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 7 = 7.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 14 = 14.
I rolled 1d20, the result is 15 = 15.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

Init

I rolled 1d20+5, the result is 19, 5 = 24.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

Darker

init

init
I rolled 1d20+3, the result is 3, 3 = 6.
Fixxxer
Fixxxer's picture

Init

Init
I rolled 1d20+2, the result is 10, 2 = 12.
Talanall
Talanall's picture

Are vermin with the fiendish template mindless in Pathfinder? They aren't in 3.5 because they change types to magical beast, and additionally the 3.5 template raises minimum Int to 3, which necessitates that they also speak or understand a language of some kind.

But Pathfinder's fiendish templating rules are quite different. I'm not too worried because the summon monster spells include built in friend/foe differentiation, but I'm trying to ascertain whether Dalvar can actually direct fiendish vermin that he summons.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

deadDMwalking
deadDMwalking's picture

Initiative

I rolled 1d20+7, the result is 2, 7 = 9.
Talanall
Talanall's picture

Also, I have queries about flight in Pathfinder. The rules for flight provide that if a creature with wings takes damage while flying, it loses altitude unless it succeeds on a Fly check.

Does this altitude loss accumulate within the course of a round (that is, if a flying creature is damage twice, it can potentially fall 20 feet)? And if the altitude loss is sufficient to bring the flying creature to the ground, does it suffer falling damage? I'm inclined to think the answer to both questions is a yes, but I'm not the DM.

Also, there is a provision in the rules for collisions while flying, which applies to winged flight with objects of the flier's size or larger. I am not sure how to determine object sizes, however. D&D 3.5e isn't very good at providing guidance to the DM with regard to whether (for example) a human-sized chair is Small, Medium, Large, or whatever, and Pathfinder looks to have adopted Pathfinder's rules almost verbatim. So I feel like I'm groping in the dark, a bit.

If Dalvar were to conjure a giant sheet of canvas or sailcloth in front of an oncoming wasp, would that count as a Large object, for example?

On a related note, how strong/smooth is the current in the river? Given all the rain lately, I guess it must be running high and fast.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

I'm going to rule that no, fiendish vermin don't gain an Intelligence score. That doesn't mean Dalvar can't direct them; but he is probably limited to the kinds of things you can tell a mindless construct or undead creature to do, which we should extrapolate from v3.5 rules because the mindless condition is also something the Core rules of Pathfinder have relatively little to say about.

I discussed this briefly with @Cronono as it pertained to telling skeletons and zombies what to do. Basically, my take on it is that I have to do a little hand-waving and exercise DM fiat to determine where the line is. I like the idea of limiting orders to a single sentence and either framing it as "Go here then do this" or "If X happens, do Y in response." Sort of like programming a machine to do something.

The reason mindless creatures (anything without an Intelligence score; not simply a score of 0 but actually not having a number in that slot at all) don't ever learn feats or gain skill points is because, among other things, being mindless means you can't form or retain memories. I think we've established previously that Dalvar summons the same fiendish rat over and over again; if not, one specimen probably looks a lot like others of its kind, but for Dalvar's part I think he is pretty convinced it's the same rat. This doesn't mean he is required to do so, but even if he were to summon the same fiendish spider or whatever every time, it would never remember him or anyone else in the party. You couldn't summon it and direct it to attack the one-eyed man in one encounter, then because he escaped the PCs summon the same spider again the next day and tell it to "attack the same guy as before" or anything to that effect.

Unfortunately, we have to sort of play it by ear because it would be impossible to establish hard and fast rules for what you can and can't order a mindless creature to do. In the case of the bloody skeletons animated by Werner, his last order to them was to advance along the bottom of the riverbed for X distance. Is this something a mindless creature would be able to successfully gauge? I don't know. I could similarly split hairs on all sorts of other orders; what if you ordered a fiendish spider to wait in a hallway and attack anyone wearing a certain kind of uniform? Can spiders distinguish one kind of clothing from another? Can they even tell that different people are separate entities? If they are able to perceive color or count, how sophisticated is that information?

For these reasons (and because no matter which way I rule on any of the above examples, I'm just being arbitrary), I think the best course of action would just be to talk it out whenever you're interacting with a mindless creature and try to find a solution that works for both player and DM.

Re: flight, the answers to both of your questions would be yes, because the wording under the Fly skill seems to be explicit. So the unintended descent interrupts whatever else is going on; I guess this means that if you begin a full attack action next to a flying creature and it fails its Fly check after taking damage from your first attack, you wouldn't be able to roll your other attacks against the same target unless you had reach or something else is going on. If you were able to attack it more than once in a round, you could certainly force it to keep making checks. I think over the course of a single round, if the same flying creature is forced to fall 10' repeatedly then makes contact with the ground, we would rule it as falling the total distance and not just 10' for the last failed skill check.

Re: the sizes of objects, yes, this is another area where we kind of have to guess about how big something is based on its relative size to something that we know to be a specific size. So, if it's roughly the size of an adult human, it's Medium. I would probably count some barrels in this group, but most are closer to Small size. A dinner plate would probably be tiny, since they're smaller than goblins but larger than frogs. A Large sheet that was strong enough to resist the forward momentum of a wasp with any significant force at all would probably be quite a bit larger than a tablecloth but quite a bit smaller than a parachute. Maybe a King-sized bedsheet? Of course if it's just floating in the air over the river, I'm not sure that I would classify touching it as a "collision." Like I don't collide with a spiderweb if I walk into one and it gets all over my face. The spider might disagree, but it's relatively harmless from my perspective.

Assuming the sheet stopped a wasp in its tracks, however, and it fell far enough as a result to splash down, that's a pretty great outcome. Speaking of the river, yes, this is definitely not a part you would want to try to swim across if you aren't trained in Athletics. It's not exactly rapids, but the "Additional Rules" chapter of the Core Rulebook reveals that the average current for a river is 3mph. It's probably closer to 5 or 6mph right now.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

MinusInnocence wrote:

I'm going to rule that no, fiendish vermin don't gain an Intelligence score. That doesn't mean Dalvar can't direct them; but he is probably limited to the kinds of things you can tell a mindless construct or undead creature to do, which we should extrapolate from v3.5 rules because the mindless condition is also something the Core rules of Pathfinder have relatively little to say about.

I discussed this briefly with @Cronono as it pertained to telling skeletons and zombies what to do. Basically, my take on it is that I have to do a little hand-waving and exercise DM fiat to determine where the line is. I like the idea of limiting orders to a single sentence and either framing it as "Go here then do this" or "If X happens, do Y in response." Sort of like programming a machine to do something.

The reason mindless creatures (anything without an Intelligence score; not simply a score of 0 but actually not having a number in that slot at all) don't ever learn feats or gain skill points is because, among other things, being mindless means you can't form or retain memories.

This all makes sense. Thank you for clarifying where we stand for this kind of question.

Quote:
I think we've established previously that Dalvar summons the same fiendish rat over and over again; if not, one specimen probably looks a lot like others of its kind, but for Dalvar's part I think he is pretty convinced it's the same rat. This doesn't mean he is required to do so, but even if he were to summon the same fiendish spider or whatever every time, it would never remember him or anyone else in the party. You couldn't summon it and direct it to attack the one-eyed man in one encounter, then because he escaped the PCs summon the same spider again the next day and tell it to "attack the same guy as before" or anything to that effect.

I think we probably ought to settle something, on this topic. The PFSRD says:

PFSRD wrote:
A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower, but it is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can't be summoned again.

When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have.

I have been operating from the assumption that Fluffy the Hellrat is an unique individual, and that Dalvar, who really is a terrible person, summons Fluffy preferentially to subject him to the discomfort and terror involved in being sent into combat, pretty much just because he can and he thinks it's funny. Along the same lines, he refers to this hapless creature as "Fluffy" because its name sounds vaguely similar, and he likes to mock creatures that are helpless to retaliate against him.

I don't think Dalvar has ever summoned two fiendish rats at the same time, but he certainly could, either by preparing multiple spells or using summon monster II. My assumption would be that these would be different individuals. And similarly, if Fluffy is killed in battle, Dalvar would be unable to summon Fluffy again—but his summon monster spells can still produce a rat who performs identically in combat. He just can't summon Fluffy anymore, at least until 24 hours pass and the eternal Conga line of humiliation and suffering starts moving again for the poor rat.

Or at least, that's what I have been assuming to have been the case.

Quote:

Re: flight, the answers to both of your questions would be yes, because the wording under the Fly skill seems to be explicit. So the unintended descent interrupts whatever else is going on; I guess this means that if you begin a full attack action next to a flying creature and it fails its Fly check after taking damage from your first attack, you wouldn't be able to roll your other attacks against the same target unless you had reach or something else is going on. If you were able to attack it more than once in a round, you could certainly force it to keep making checks. I think over the course of a single round, if the same flying creature is forced to fall 10' repeatedly then makes contact with the ground, we would rule it as falling the total distance and not just 10' for the last failed skill check.

This is a matter of some potential interest for the combat that appears to be looming ahead of us, so I'm glad we cleared it up.

Quote:

Re: the sizes of objects, yes, this is another area where we kind of have to guess about how big something is based on its relative size to something that we know to be a specific size. So, if it's roughly the size of an adult human, it's Medium. I would probably count some barrels in this group, but most are closer to Small size. A dinner plate would probably be tiny, since they're smaller than goblins but larger than frogs. A Large sheet that was strong enough to resist the forward momentum of a wasp with any significant force at all would probably be quite a bit larger than a tablecloth but quite a bit smaller than a parachute. Maybe a King-sized bedsheet? Of course if it's just floating in the air over the river, I'm not sure that I would classify touching it as a "collision." Like I don't collide with a spiderweb if I walk into one and it gets all over my face. The spider might disagree, but it's relatively harmless from my perspective.

It sounds as if you consider size as primarily a volumetric consideration, then, with the caveat that something that takes up a lot of space but has very little physical coherence (like a typical cobweb) may not really fit into this scheme. Is that right?

Quote:

Assuming the sheet stopped a wasp in its tracks, however, and it fell far enough as a result to splash down, that's a pretty great outcome. Speaking of the river, yes, this is definitely not a part you would want to try to swim across if you aren't trained in Athletics. It's not exactly rapids, but the "Additional Rules" chapter of the Core Rulebook reveals that the average current for a river is 3mph. It's probably closer to 5 or 6mph right now.

As a follow-up question, I guess I'd like to know whether a flying creature that splashes down into water can take to the air again under normal circumstances. It seems clear to me a that a waterfowl or similar bird certainly would be able to do so (because it has a swim speed), but I don't know about a robin or crow.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

That's a good find on the verbiage from the section on summoning vs calling. Repeated references to the subject as "it" certainly seems to imply it's a specific, unique creature each time according to RAW.

Re: size, yes, I think volume is probably the easiest way to make sense of the size rules. But there are definitely exceptions, like in the case of something like a rope or a sail.

I think you're right that different kinds of animals probably can't fly effectively if their wings are hampered by contact with various fluids. That's how it works in real life. I will look up videos for wasps that get wet and report back.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

deadDMwalking
deadDMwalking's picture

Don't look at videos of wasps. They are the worst creatures in the world. You might try to destroy the earth if you watch too many of their videos. Please, for your sanity AND THE FATE OF THE WORLD, don't do it.

If you have to make an assumption about the capabilities of a wasp, assume that they can do whatever they want to. Can they swim? Why not? Can the take off from water? They wouldn't be hellish nightmare creatures if they couldn't, now would they?

I'm going to update the Nightmare fuel thread.

Talanall
Talanall's picture

MinusInnocence wrote:

Re: size, yes, I think volume is probably the easiest way to make sense of the size rules. But there are definitely exceptions, like in the case of something like a rope or a sail.

Okay, so if I were asking about the size of a net meant to be wielded by a Medium creature, what would that be?

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Like the kind on the weapon chart you can entangle people with, right? Going by volume, it can envelop a Medium size creature; otherwise it wouldn't be able to entangle them, I think. It's not like tossing a blanket over someone's head. So I would probably rule it is Medium even though the amount of material a net consists of is relatively sparse compared to the body of an adult human.

I can see the argument being made for a net like that being Small instead, too. I just lean the other way.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

A net can envelop a Large creature, at least if it is sized to be wielded by a Medium creature.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Hmm. Well, in that case, I think I would rule it to be Medium sized after all.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

I think this concludes my weird questions, at least for the moment.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Tentatively, I'm leaning toward creatures that have both a Fly and Swim speed being able to fly again immediately after their wings get wet. This would also cover creatures that don't have wings at all but can still somehow fly. The trouble is figuring out how long creatures that don't fall into this category would have to wait before their wings "recharge." One round? 1d4 rounds? Does keeping track of something like that meaningfully enrich the game or are we just doing it because that's how it works in real life?

So what I'm going to do is... nothing at all, at least right now. We're going to assume the wasps can take flight again on their next action after being dunked in the river, if that is their desire (which it almost certainly will be because they kind of suck if they aren't flying). I will make a final ruling on the issue later.

In the meantime, this combat starts with something that is sort of like a surprise round. You weren't trying to ambush the wasps or anything, but not all of them were aware of your presence at the time I called for initiative. One had ventured close enough to be able to roll another Perception check at a low enough penalty from extreme distance. Two more were close enough to that wasp to notice that it noticed you, and will join the combat right away. The other two, and any others that might be lurking about, will have to wait until Round 1 to act and may not be able to do so anyway, if they can't notice what's going on. Especially if the fighting takes place where Argus, Dalvar and Feruq rode off to, you guys are quite a bit further than 200' away from the wasp nest. They may not be able to see or hear what's going on until it's too late to help.

Random
I rolled 1d20, the result is 8 = 8.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

What do you think of the idea that on a successful Swim check, a splashed-down flying creature may (in lieu of swimming) take to the air again, subject to the same penalties to its flight speed as would apply to a non-swimmer trying to deal with water (1/4 as a move action or 1/2 as a full-round)? If a creature moves less than half its fly speed in a single round, the Fly skill has some rules that would apply as well, but the DC is low.

This would reflect the threat posed by turbulence of the Churnett River at present. There is a substantive difference between falling into a still pond versus falling into a section of rapids.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

deadDMwalking
deadDMwalking's picture

I like it. I think there should be a chance we can drown these f@ckers. I know if we fall in, we could drown.

Talanall
Talanall's picture

Realistically, I don't think they'll drown just because Pathfinder's rules for swimming indicate that most creatures can hold their breath for a number of rounds equal to 2x their Con score, and giant wasps probably are pretty strong and will manage to succeed on enough Athletics checks to survive. They're the size of a horse, or something crazy like that, so their Str scores must be through the roof.

Not that I'll be sad if they drown, or get battered to death on some rocks or something like that. But more likely they'll just get swept some distance downstream and then get out again. I think it'd be tactically sound to try to spill them into the drink if we can, but that's mostly because it'll suck if we have to fight a bunch of them all at once.

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

deadDMwalking
deadDMwalking's picture

I know we rolled init, but I was wondering if there wasn't an IC update that failed to post...

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

No, I'm just way behind.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

Sorry for the delay, guys. I've been busier than usual now that summer is starting and some minor health issues have been eating away at my free time and ability to focus on work. It looks like we're in the clear now, though.

I updated the IC post. The wasp nest is about 40 squares south of where Garyld and Thunk are standing, somewhere in the neighborhood of X4/Y50. The wasps, which are currently not on the map, are all still on the far side of the river. One, the one that detected the Heroes' presence, is actually closer to Argus, Dalvar and Feruq than it is to Garyld and Thunk; but it remains to be seen which group of characters it will move to engage in combat, if any. Each wasp will have to make that decision randomly, with Wasps 4 and 5 possibly being influenced by wanting to follow Wasp 1 to see what all the buzz is about. Also, for those who saw the post before I edited it, no Gideon is not present for this combat (that you know of). I was totally talking about Garyld the whole time.

Anyway, Garyld has a class feature that confers a +2 bonus on initiative checks to allies that can see him. Currently, because he's sitting on the ground next to thick undergrowth, that includes Argus and Thunk, but as time passes and people move around that may change and will influence where you fall in the count.

Wasp 1 is currently in X15/Y40 and acts after Dalvar.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

Talanall
Talanall's picture

Is it evident that Wasp 1 is about to head our way?

Wæs se grimma gæst Grendel haten,
mære mearcstapa, se þe moras heold

MinusInnocence
MinusInnocence's picture

No, and if it is going to do that, there's no way currently to know what its target will be. Dalvar could delay until after the wasp takes its action, or ready an action to do X when it gets within 30' of Garyld or one of the PCs, if that is your preference.

It's actually pretty far away right now anyway so his options for how to engage Wasp 1 are limited.

"Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

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